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Choice with or without GPS

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TASSANI_Quentin

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Hello everyone, I am considering purchasing the Ardumower.

To begin with I am sorry to have to use google traduct, not being at the top level in English and even less in German ... (I am French, faithful to our international reputation: D).

Here I hesitate for budgetary reasons to take the model with wire perimeter.

On the wiki, I saw that the maximum area was 1000m² for this solution. I have a plot of 2600m². I thought then to define 3 distinct zones each with its own peripheral wire. Connect the 3 perimeters to a "programmer" to make a weekly distribution of the mowing days on the 3 zones: Monday zone 1, Tuesday zone 2, Wednesday zone 3 etc ...

Do you think this is achievable?

The only thing that prompts me to choose the GPS option then is whether it can be used against theft? If we can locate the device after it has been stolen?

And if I choose the GPS option I also worry about the configuration of my land, a mowing area going around my house as closely as possible, can the antenna to be placed on the roof then cover the area? entire area adjacent to the house including whether the robot is on the other side of the house from the antenna? Would the precision then remain the same?

I do not have a very advanced experience in electronics, I understood that the welds had to be done on the electronic board. Do you think this is within everyone's reach?

Thank you in advance for your advice.

Cordially.
 
Du kannst ohne RTK (GPS) starten. Das ist viel günstiger und für Dich - no advanced experiences in electronics - und Herausforderung genug.
GPS als Diebstahlschutz würde nur in Funkreichweite funktionieren und müsste programmiert werden. Außerdem macht das nur Sinn, wenn das Gehäuse auch diebstahlgeschützt ist. Es gibt bereits user - Lösungen, bei denen der Mäher zwischen mehreren Zonen wechselt (einfaches GPS). Man kann den Mäher auch zeitgesteuert am Perimeterdraht entlang fahren lassen um die Zonen zu wechseln.
Mit „no advanced experiences in electronics„ ist die sicherste Lösung ein Komplettpaket aus dem shop zu nehmen.
Für 2600qm könnte man auch einen „großen“ Mäher bauen.

Gruß Fürst Ruprecht
 
TASSANI_Quentin schrieb:
Hello everyone, I am considering purchasing the Ardumower.

To begin with I am sorry to have to use google traduct, not being at the top level in English and even less in German ... (I am French, faithful to our international reputation: D).

Here I hesitate for budgetary reasons to take the model with wire perimeter.

On the wiki, I saw that the maximum area was 1000m² for this solution. I have a plot of 2600m². I thought then to define 3 distinct zones each with its own peripheral wire. Connect the 3 perimeters to a "programmer" to make a weekly distribution of the mowing days on the 3 zones: Monday zone 1, Tuesday zone 2, Wednesday zone 3 etc ...

Do you think this is achievable?

The only thing that prompts me to choose the GPS option then is whether it can be used against theft? If we can locate the device after it has been stolen?

And if I choose the GPS option I also worry about the configuration of my land, a mowing area going around my house as closely as possible, can the antenna to be placed on the roof then cover the area? entire area adjacent to the house including whether the robot is on the other side of the house from the antenna? Would the precision then remain the same?

I do not have a very advanced experience in electronics, I understood that the welds had to be done on the electronic board. Do you think this is within everyone's reach?

Thank you in advance for your advice.

Cordially.
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Multiple area is not an issue with RFID tag and 3 Wifi sender.
It's also possible to unlock mower with a particular RFID tag so mower can only be use if you have the tag (Same as a pin password).
2600 m2: it's not possible to tell you it's OK or not, because it's depend on how many obstacle, grass growing speed,battery quality,temperature etc.......
 
Merci pour vos réponses.

Je note que la fonction GPS n'est pas une solution antivol, dans ce cas en effet j'irais pour le câble périphérique.

Je ne sais pas quelles sont les statistiques de vol des tondeuses à gazon robotisées ... peut-être que je suis trop inquiet à ce sujet sans raison. Mais est-ce que le prix fait réfléchir.

Et je comprends la remarque de la boîte antivol, si quelqu'un de motivé ouvre la boîte en 2 min pour retirer le GPS ... pas vraiment d'intérêt en effet. Cela dit, il doit encore savoir qu'il existe un GPS.

Mais du coup je me rends compte qu'il n'y a pas de système antivol? Une fois de plus peut-être que je surestime ce risque ... et je sous-estime le côté DIY de l'ardumower.

Prince, malheureusement je n'ai pas compris le sens de cette phrase: "Vous pouvez aussi laisser la tondeuse tourner en fonction du temps le long du câble périphérique pour changer les zones.". Pourriez-vous le reformuler pour moi, s'il vous plaît?

En effet ayant peu de connaissances j'irais sans hésiter pour un kit complet. Mais du coup quand vous me conseillez une "grande" tondeuse vous m'invitez à aller plus loin et à fabriquer mon propre modèle +/- avec 2 moteurs de coupe? Si c'est ça, je ne pense pas que je me lancerais dans un tel projet ...

Bernard, en ce qui concerne le WiFi, c'est l'option avec un fournisseur NTRIP, est-ce exact? Si c'est le cas, je regarde la wikipedia concernant cette option pour bien comprendre et ne pas poser une question dont les réponses sont déjà présentes sur le wiki. Mais à première vue, oui, cela pourrait être convaincant. Même si là aussi la configuration me semble complexe pour le moment.

Pour être honnête, j'aime les défis, la maison est une acquisition très récente avec beaucoup de rénovation, je ne crains absolument pas les travaux manuels et tout refaire moi-même. J'aime apprendre. Mais là j'ai un peu peur de me brûler les ailes avec l'électronique +/- programmation ... Bon alors il faut se lancer dis-tu ... mais se tromper avec 700 € (ou 1050 € avec NTRIP) ... là suffit pour faire quelques mauvaises nuits ... bon après 700 € (soit 1050 €) par rapport au prix des appareils commerciaux recommandés pour ce quartier ... vous me direz ... ça reste incomparable. C'est environ 3 ou 4 fois plus à Husqvarna. Mais cela doit encore fonctionner. : RÉ

Bon après ce forum et le wiki sont plutôt rassurants. ;)

Merci encore pour votre aide.
 
Thank you for your answers.

I note that the GPS function is not an anti-theft solution, in this case indeed I would go for the perimeter wire.

I don't know what the robotic lawnmower theft statistics are ... maybe I'm too worried about this for no reason. But is that the price makes think about it.

And I understand the remark of the anti-theft box, if someone motivated opens the box in 2 min to remove the GPS ... not really of interest indeed. That said, he still has to know that there is a GPS.

But suddenly I realize that there is no anti-theft system? Once again maybe I'm overestimating this risk ... and I'm underestimating the DIY side of ardumower.

Prince, unfortunately I did not understand the meaning of this sentence: "You can also let the mower run depending on the time along the perimeter wire to change the zones.". Could you rephrase it for me, please?

Indeed having little knowledge I would go without hesitation for a complete kit. But suddenly when you advise me a "large" mower you invite me to go further and make my own model +/- with 2 cutting motors? If that's it, I don't think I would embark on such a project ...

Bernard, as far as WiFi is concerned, this is the option with an NTRIP provider, is that correct? If so, I look at the wikipedia concerning this option to fully understand and not ask a question whose answers are already present on the wiki. But at first glance, yes it might be convincing. Even if here too the configuration seems complex to me for the moment.

To be honest, I like challenges, the house is a very recent acquisition with a lot of renovation, I absolutely do not mind manual work and redo everything myself. I like to learn. But here I am a little afraid of burning my wings with the electronics +/- programming ... Well then you have to get started you say ... but get wrong with 700 € (or 1050 € with NTRIP) ... there is enough to make a few bad nights ... good after 700 € (or 1050 €) compared to the price of commercial devices recommended for this area ... you will tell me ... it remains incomparable. It is around 3 or 4 times more at Husqvarna. But it still has to work. : D

Good after this forum and the wiki are rather reassuring. ;)

Thanks again for your help anyway.
 
RTK: You don't need an RTK station to receive a differential GPS signal. You can generate the reference signal with a second stationary GPS receiver. However, this increases costs and complexity.
The standard electronics kit from the shop can be operated with two mower motors. But then you have to build a housing yourself. Examples of larger mowers can be found here in the forum.
In order to mow different zones, the mower can be controlled with -RFID-Chips (positioned in the ground), -with a simple GPS signal, -the mower can drive along the perimeter wire and start mowing at different times. For these solutions you need the help of users in the forum.
Theft of mowers is not an issue in Germany. Build an ugly, big, dirty mower, it will lower the risk of theft.
I think Bernard is talking about (local) wireless LAN modules.
In my personal experience, there will be MANY bad nights if you don't take the standard solution. With every change, new problems / tasks arise that have to be solved and that also work. If you enjoy this a lot, then you will not be able to do anything more on your property / house.

But maybe you should go the easy way first. You start with the kit from the shop. If everything works and the mower mows, you will see if the terrain is too big. Then you can buy a second mower motor and use the parts (and experience) you have to build a larger mower. Then there is also time for your house.
Gruß Fürst Ruprecht
 
Hello (again since I answered you in private, but I don't want to appear rude in public: D))

I must admit that you lost me, for me GPS = satellite ... here is my level: D.

But I will try to get past that.

So you tell me that I can create a kind of mini-location which would allow me to tell the mower when to start mowing on such and such a day to cover everything ... in theory it seems very, very interesting to me. But in practice you tell me that it is much more expensive and I confess that I do not know at all how it works ...

Ultimately, RFID in theory seems to me more "simple" I visualize the principle well, I tell him day 1 you stop at chip 1, day 2 at chip 2 etc ... it's pretty good and in this case a single peripheral wire ... And that suddenly it is programmed directly on the Arduino? Rather easily?

I have a question about the wire, it can be several hundred meters without losing its signal function? In theory, the peripheral wire is not limiting? Is it just the mower's cutting capacity and its ability to go anywhere that limits the area to 1000m²?

Maybe I will listen to your advice, which is ultimately common sense. Start at the base even if it means evolving in a second step.

For the moment the system that I mentioned with 3 distinct perimeters that I program seems simpler to me given the current state of my knowledge ... even if there in practice I do not yet know how to automate this ... lol.

And besides finally without speaking about the systems which you explained to me, it seems to me that you did not tell me if this could be done as I mentioned it at the very beginning?

And then anyway there is still the hardest thing to do before starting: convince Madam: D.

Thanks again anyway.
cordially
 
Hello
thorsten-ac = user, who modified Azurite-Software to work with simple GPS-Receiver.
https://www.marotronics.de/NEO-6M-GPS-Modul-GY-GPS6MV2-NEO-6M-Flight-Controller-zb-fuer-Arduino = simple GPS-Receiver, signal tolerance: few meters
https://www.marotronics.de/simpleRTK2B-Starter-Kit-LR-IP67 = two Signalboards with GPS-Receiver, System signal tolerance: few cm. One board is mounted on the mower, the other is located at a fix and known point and generates a Referenz-Signal. There are professional providers for the provision of the reference signal (via internet). If you get the Referenzsignal from a provider, you only need one of the RTK-Boards.
I don't use RTK myself and have little knowledge.
Perimeterwire and Signal:
When driving over the perimeter wire, the polarity of the received signal changes and the mower knows that it has passed over the wire. The signal is at its maximum on the wire. If the mower does not receive a signal, it stops and goes to fault. This can happen - in the event of an electrical fault - if the mower is too far away from the wire (usually outside the garden) but also in your case if the area becomes too large. The minimum necessary signal strength can be set.
Thorsten's mower leaves the charging station and follows the perimeter wire. In doing so, it calculates the approximate distance from the mower to a GPS target point. If it is near the target point, it leaves the program mode “follow the wire” and changes to the program mode „mowing“. Thorsten uses several perimeter loops (I think).
Bernard : uses RFID, the software is AzuriteB

Gruß Fürst Ruprecht
 
hello, by chance I read along with you;) my project is slowly waking up from the winter sleep. First Ruprecht is right. Instead of using RFID chips, I use the GPS signal to delimit actions or areas. that works pretty well. I am currently working on a course calculation to make the way from punk to point more efficient. @ Fürst Ruprecht and Bernard welcome back from the winter break;)
 
Hello,
I think this system of tracking the cable up to a certain distance and then activating mowing mode afterwards would be perfect for me.
Again when you speak of GPS, nothing to do with a satellite? We can simply program that after 10m by following the perimeter cable it mows on day 1, then at 30m on day 2 and so on, right? Or even at hour 1 then at hour 2 ...

It seems simpler to me that way. Is the basic ardumower capable of measuring a distance? Without Wifi or satellite?

Or even simpler without distance measurement, we can tell it to activate mowing after 5min of cable tracking then after 10 min of tracking then 15 etc ... which amounts to the same without even having to measure any distance .

Sorry again for my level and thank you for your help.
 
I forgot again:
Using a simulator like the one provided by honda, he finally estimated the area at 1500m² by removing the obstacles; house, swimming pool, garage, leveling wall (the land is on several levels with rather gentle slopes separating them) ... in short, we are not far from 1000m² max in the end ... and I estimate a length of cable of the order of 500m ... let's say 600m for a margin of maneuver.

Is the signal loss over 600m significant or is it correct?
 
thorsten-ac schrieb:
hello, by chance I read along with you;) my project is slowly waking up from the winter sleep. First Ruprecht is right. Instead of using RFID chips, I use the GPS signal to delimit actions or areas. that works pretty well. I am currently working on a course calculation to make the way from punk to point more efficient. @ Fürst Ruprecht and Bernard welcome back from the winter break;)
Zum Vergrößern anklicken....
this is a really good option, specially with large zone; is it available directly in the firmware or did you make modification?
i think this could be easier to implement that rfid (even if this is not really difficult)
thanks
 
Hello,

cost is a valid point and especially, RTK GPS solution works great but is expensive and, for me, too expensive for a DIY solution. However even if using perimeter wire, cost can still be an issue. Imagine if you purchase anything from shop (you won't be able to purchase parts for less as the prices are really great there), you'll be close to 800€ w.o. shipping costs.

One point we did the past years regulary here was to purchase an old, damaged commercial mower and just replace electronics. Electronics for Ardumower will sum up to approx 150-200€. Price for a damaged mower depends. My first one was for free.

If this is a option for you, check which kind of motors the mower use. DC motors are the easiest one to be used and you will be able to bring a robot to life within a couple of days. Brushless motors are common at high priced commercial mowers. If you get one of these, it is harder (but not impossible) so use them. There is a solution for Ardumower with brushless motors at shop.

Just my two cents.
Patrick
 
TASSANI_Quentin schrieb:
Hello,
I think this system of tracking the cable up to a certain distance and then activating mowing mode afterwards would be perfect for me.
Again when you speak of GPS, nothing to do with a satellite? We can simply program that after 10m by following the perimeter cable it mows on day 1, then at 30m on day 2 and so on, right? Or even at hour 1 then at hour 2 ...

It seems simpler to me that way. Is the basic ardumower capable of measuring a distance? Without Wifi or satellite?

Or even simpler without distance measurement, we can tell it to activate mowing after 5min of cable tracking then after 10 min of tracking then 15 etc ... which amounts to the same without even having to measure any distance .

Sorry again for my level and thank you for your help.
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It's the AZURITBER Level1 se 4.1.8
Mower track the wire for 50 m for example and start to mow
Using Bylane mode help mower to mow near the start location for long duration
Using Random mode help mower to go everywhere in the area without track on grass.

AzuritBer Firmware (English) – www.wiki.ardumower.de

wiki.ardumower.de wiki.ardumower.de

I am fully agree with Paddy for used mower.
 
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